The convention should be the same as always

I see Hillary trolls and poor judgment haven't yet been eliminated from MyDD, seeing a diary on the rec list promoting some demand that Hillary be given a roll call vote at the convention.

Honestly, I know nothing of convention procedure other than what I've watched on TV in the past and what I read about the 1944 convention in separate biographies of Harry Truman and Henry Wallace.

But......

Is it normal to give a losing candidate a "separate" roll call vote?

My observation has been that every state votes, that almost everyone in every delegation votes for the nominee, and that a few stragglers vote for other candidates for whatever reasons.

I assume giving Hillary a roll call vote is something different.

If so, it's stupid.

Hillary deserves no special treatment.  She is just another presidential candidate who lost and dropped out.  Yes it was close, yes she has supporters more passionate and lasting than the normal losing candidate.  That doesn't matter.

The purpose of the convention is to help the nominee win.  And helping the nominee win requires at minimum absolute unity at the convention.  Giving some random losing candidate a separate roll call vote takes away from that.

But having briefly gone through the merits above, I am heartened to know that if one thing has become crystal clear, it's that the normal pattern has been followed, and Hillary is getting no special treatment from superdelegates after the primaries ended or since then, and that she hasn't acted like she deserves any other than wanting help retiring campaign debt which I imagine is not so unique if never before so public.  And more importantly and heartening than that, it's become clear that most Hillary voters are not cultists at all, but rather ordinary voters with little or no emotional investment in a candidate who lost.  You wouldn't know that from reading MyDD because MyDD participants are anything but "ordinary voters," regardless of what candidates they support.  But out in the larger world, Obama's Democratic defection rate is down to normal and maybe even better than normal for this stage of the race.  That being the case, it reinforces none of these silly demands will get an airing.

So the Hillarybots can continue their whiny screeds complaining they want x, y, and z as "conditions" for unity or otherwise just as a "show of respect," but none of it matters.  I've never seen a candidate with ANY supporters who were so politically immature as the few but vocal Hillary supporters who have been allowed to dominate and embarrass MyDD and become visible on Hillary cult sites.

Hillary lost.  I'm sure it hurts.  Maybe it hurts some of her supporters as much as it hurt all of us when Kerry lost, and when Gore was declared the loser.  But Hillary losing is Hillary supporters' problem, something for them to get over, just like all of us had to get over those defeats.  I know some people NEVER got over Gore not getting sworn in or Kerry having lost(and re Kerry some even continue believing stupid conspiracy theories about Ohio), but at least the lion's share of Democrats recognize what's done is done and move on.

I just wish these silly complaints that Hillary would get x, y, and z disappeared from here and were relegated to the Hillary cult sites, like I THOUGHT they were until a few minutes before I typed this diary.



Display:


Tip jar. (nm) (1.50 / 2)

nm


by DCCyclone on Sun Jul 06, 2008 at 08:16:24 AM EST

Re: The convention should be the same as always (2.00 / 1)

Agreed.  I am still sore about Hilary losing but it's not news, and it is in no way helping.  Unity should not be based on ultimatums but on the fact that we could be royally screwed ... again.


nothing ever came from a life that was a simple one
by selfevident on Sun Jul 06, 2008 at 08:22:22 AM EST

Re: The convention should be the same as always (2.00 / 6)

no tip for YOU.

If the DNC wants Hillary to do the roll-call, great.  If they don't, fine.

Giving some random losing candidate a separate roll call vote takes away from that.

random?  excuse me while I have a laughing fit.

ok, back now.  Hillary & Obama SPLIT the democrat primaries down the middle.  She isn't Mike Gravel.  

It is called respect.  Something you know nothing about


by colebiancardi on Sun Jul 06, 2008 at 08:25:40 AM EST

Re: The convention should be the same as always (none / 0)

Why don't you respect the other candidates?  Hillary's fellow losing candidates?


John McCain wants to stay in Iraq.
by ihaveseenenough on Mon Jul 07, 2008 at 11:26:50 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The convention should be the same as always (2.00 / 2)

This is another "nontroversy".  Obama hasn't signaled that he wants Clinton to be ignored at the convention.  A roll call of some sort is probably inevitable, and since each candidate got delegates in every state the formula is not that difficult to figure out.

"How votes Alabama?"

"Madame Speaker, Alabama gives 29 of its votes to the most excellent senator from New York, Hillary Clinton! [Pause for cheers].  And it gives 31 votes to the next president of the United States, Barack Obama!  [More cheers].

What's the big deal?  And then, after all of the states have voted, there will be a motion to vote again, all of the delegates will change their votes to Obama, and he'll win by acclamation.


by IncognitoErgoSum on Sun Jul 06, 2008 at 08:58:05 AM EST

That would be consistent w/my diary...... (none / 0)

My principle point is that the convention should operate just as it always does.  I stated that it's not 100% clear to me what these Hillary cultists are demanding, but that it appeared they were asking for something different than that which is always done.

There has always been a roll call vote in every convention I've watched.  If all the Hillary people "want" is for Hillary's pledged delegates and her committed superdelegates to vote for Hillary in the roll call, they're free to do that without Obama giving "permission."  But the Hillary people are making a demand of some kind, which makes me think they're asking for something more than that.  Why does there need to be an organized movement to do what has always been done?


by DCCyclone on Sun Jul 06, 2008 at 11:21:07 AM EST
[ Parent ]

This isn't helpful. n/t (2.00 / 1)


Even John McCain lusts after teh engels.
by sricki on Sun Jul 06, 2008 at 11:04:46 AM EST

Re: The convention should be the same as always (none / 0)

It's to be fully expected that Hillary will instruct her delegates to vote unanimously for Obama.


by Beren on Sun Jul 06, 2008 at 01:04:37 PM EST

Re: The convention should be the same as always (2.00 / 2)

I think the point they are making is that the convention should be the same as always. Howard Dean said something in a NYTimes article that may have implied otherwise. The whole thing about a symbolic vote and unity alarmed some Democrats. I wish the NYT had elaborated on what Dean meant.

I have come to understand that past ballots included the names of all the candidates. Some have  concluded  from Dean's comments that Mrs. Clinton's name would not appear on the first ballot. I do believe Dean is an imbecile, but surely he can't be that stupid. If he meant to exclude Clinton from being nominated and/or from the ballot it would deliver the final death blow to any possibility of unity.

I think Dean was saying he would not encourage people to from a symbolic vote for Hillary on the first ballot because it would make Obama look bad and the party look divided especially if Obama doesn't get enough votes in the first round.

I don't know how Dean would control how people voted or why the woman in the article would ask about a symbolic ballot. So I could be wrong in both instances about what Dean meant.


"No self-respecting woman should wish or work for the success of a party that ignores her." - Susan B. Anthony
by feelfree on Sun Jul 06, 2008 at 03:01:07 PM EST


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